Deploying a new SM Server - What is the most stable version?

Brian Bjerring-Jensen - VonBjerring GmbH Replied

11/10/2024 at 9:45 AM

We run 8930 and have tried upgrading on several occasions. Always to return to 8930 since its the one with the fewest issues so far.

Zach Sylvester Replied

11/11/2024 at 7:17 AM

Employee Post

I would recommend running the newest version. 8930 has known issues.

Zach Sylvester

Software Developer
SmarterTools Inc.

www.smartertools.com

Richard Laliberte Replied

11/11/2024 at 8:02 AM

i would say it depends on the functionality you are going to be using. If you aren't using MAPI and such, then you could use the latest version (we currently have 9056 with no issues)

If you are deploying internationally, use MAPI, or a number of other more advanced features, there are "less" issues with 8930.

The other option, if your users are open to it, you could install the latest (9056) and help SM by summitting bug reports through the forums and such. Real world testing seems to be find a lot more bugs, and has led to a lot more stability.

Brian Bjerring-Jensen - VonBjerring GmbH Replied

11/11/2024 at 8:30 AM

We use MAPI and EAS and 8930 is the only one that delivers a decent performance and no users are reporting mail issues.

On all other versions, our EAS is screwed and mails randomly synchronizes on mobile clients or MAPI having issues in outlook with headers dissappearing.

9056 was promising until users started reporting missing mails on Android clients. I didnt hesitate to download to 8930 and issues went away.

Daniele (TDBnet) Replied

11/11/2024 at 9:49 AM

Yesterday I went online using build 9056 pro edition on a new server.

I've only some annoying issues on signatures when editing aliases, and minor issues on bounce messages. Support said they will be fixed on next release.

It's been almost a month since the last release so I hope they're doing an excellent job with the next one.

Daniele

MattyT Replied

11/11/2024 at 8:00 PM

I suspect that if doing a new server with new domains, and not upgrading, then 9056 (or latest) is probably best. Many of us here have SM installations that have been upgraded many times over many years, and thus bring along a lot of "baggage" from older versions upon each upgrade. I, too, attempted to upgrade to builds newer than 8930 but each time, I ran into odd MAPI issues requiring me to rollback. In fact, I had upgraded from 8601 to 8965 and had a slew of MAPI problems (certain Outlook mailboxes not syncing via MAPI, primarily, no matter what I did to try and rectify the problem.) My "rollback" was to 8930 which was still a year newer than what we were running previously! Many of our customers had no problems with 8965 but the few that did were so problematic that rolling back to 8930 was the least painful and the quickest solution. All the problems we encountered were MAPI/Exchange/Outlook related. Version(s) 90xx were faster and more feature rich but connectivity issues with MAPI were enough for us to retreat to the older version which made problems go away instantly. I have not tried 9056. Very frustrating as I'm a happy (and long-time) SmarterMail/SmarterTools customer but just gun-shy about upgrading right now.

Curtis Kropar www.HawaiianHope.org Replied

11/12/2024 at 1:59 AM

I would echo what others said. It depends on your user base and what your needs are. Are you going to need web access only ? are there a number of outlook users ? Android ? iPhones ?

We only have about 200 users on our server across about 15 domains. I dont think anyone of them uses outlook to sync, or syncs with iphone mail or android mail. as far as i can tell, almost all 200 users access their email through the web interface. With taht said, we rarely have any issues at all. And the issues we do have from upgrading, are same as what Matthew just said, our installation has been upgraded over and over, we started on Ver 14 about 10 years ago, and upgrade after upgrade, occasionally we have something from the old version data that creates issues with the new version software.

We are currently on 9014 and no issues reported to us at all,

www.HawaiianHope.org - Providing technology services to non profit organizations, low income families, homeless shelters, clean and sober houses and prisoner reentry programs. Since 2015, We have refurbished over 11,000 Computers !

Jade B Replied

11/12/2024 at 2:22 AM

Thanks for all the comments so far.

As this is a new server and too a new service offering we have the ability to start from scratch so I was hopeful of getting feedback from those in the industry as to what works best.

I cannot say what clients will use to access email, this varies based on each clients requirements but the overall sentiment is expect the client to use every device and service available and hope that they all work in the way that they were designed to.

One thing I have picked up on this thread is that there are a number of others out there using and offering MAPI & EWS - something that we haven't used in the past but are considering adding it to our new license when it is purchased.

Our existing servers have been around since around version 14 / 15 and have been upgraded over many years, migrated to newer hardware etc etc so there are many bugs that have crept in throughout this time but we use older versions that work, provided that there are no exploits,

This presents its own set of challenges as logging a ticket with support means that we get the "upgrade to latest version" which unfortunately is riskier than dealing with the issues that we know of, on mail servers that have in excess of 800 - 1000 domains per server.

Gabriele Maoret - SERSIS Replied

11/12/2024 at 4:37 AM

I think that for a NEW server the best is to deploy the latest build.

We too had issues with newer builds and Outlook/MAPI sync, so we downgraded to 8930 and stick there, but I bet that those issues come from upgrading.

So I bet that a new install can work better than a upgraded one.

Gabriele Maoret - Head of SysAdmins and CISO at SERSIS

Currently manages 6 SmarterMail installations (1 in the cloud for SERSIS which provides services to a few hundred third-party email domains + 5 on-premise for customers who prefer to have their mail server in-house)

J

Jay Dubb Replied

11/12/2024 at 7:38 AM

We're on the latest version right now because it had some MAPI sync fixes we really needed. But, 8930 was definitely the "least problematic" build in the past 1-2 years and we rolled back to it, twice, before finally (reluctantly) moving forward on builds. We've been somewhat disappointed with the quality of builds over the past 6-12 months because it seems some of them have been rushed to production without enough QC checks, introducing new problems that have to be quickly fixed with a followup build. We're hoping the delay since 9056 is a positive sign more testing is being done before the next build is released. SmarterMail is too good of a product to be spoiled by "catchable" bugs, so we're hoping this little phase is behind us.

Jereming Chen Replied

11/13/2024 at 4:49 PM

Employee Post

We are certainly doing our best to QC check as much as we can and catch as many bugs as possible. Unfortunately, some bugs are just not easily noticeable until they hit a real production environment where years of real data have a unique impact that is not easily caught by testing. We have caught a lot of bugs but this very nature of these production environments leave many bugs more able to slip through the cracks. We do appreciate the bugs that people are reporting as it give us a better glimpse into where our testing can be improved.

Jereming Chen

Internal Network/System Administrator

SmarterTools Inc.

www.smartertools.com

Gabriele Maoret - SERSIS Replied

11/14/2024 at 1:20 AM

Hi Jereming !

I really appreciate your work and I LOVE SmarterMail.

Unfortunately, in my case, in the new "Linux Era" releases (I've tried many, including the latest one...) I've run into a BUG that blocks MAPI synchronization with MS Outlook almost completely on some users.

There are few users who have this problem, but unfortunately, since they are paying customers and, in some cases, MANAGERS of companies that are our customers, I can't afford to keep them down for several days while you check how to resolve the bug in question (otherwise we risk losing customers...).

For this reason, I had to, in an emergency, downgrade to version 8930, which works well for customers and IMMEDIATELY resolves this bug.

This, however, unfortunately, prevents me from opening a ticket and allowing you to work on the bug.

I'm sorry I can't help more this time...

Of course, as soon as new releases will come out, I will try to upgrade and I will tell you if the problem is solved.

But if it is not solved, unfortunately, I will find myself having to downgrade to the 8930 to solve the emergency...

Gabriele Maoret - Head of SysAdmins and CISO at SERSIS

Currently manages 6 SmarterMail installations (1 in the cloud for SERSIS which provides services to a few hundred third-party email domains + 5 on-premise for customers who prefer to have their mail server in-house)

Richard Laliberte Replied

11/14/2024 at 8:20 AM

It has been almost a month since the last release (9056), hopefully we will see a big batch of fixes that solve a bunch of these problems.

I totally understand where they are coming from with QC, most major companies just can't keep up with it anymore, and real world testing is just about the only way to find all these bugs. Maybe instead of bashing SM for buggy releases, we should take a little bit of time to thank those that are testing the newer builds and finding these errors that got past their internal QC. As a developer, I totally understand the difficulties of balancing QC with customers breathing down your neck with bugs and building out new features to keep everyone happy.

Just keep testing, and they will keep fixing. They have done a pretty good job over the years trying to address everything that's found, and I'm sure that will continue.

Brian Bjerring-Jensen - VonBjerring GmbH Replied

11/14/2024 at 9:34 AM

Issue for me is replication of the issues that we see. It wouldnt take long for a supporter to logon to a teamviewer session and see whats going on instead of writing back and forth and make videos of what we see.

If we assume that production servers are a benefitting factor to problemsolving then we need to agree to the fact that our customers are suffering and we spend time solving other peoples selfinflicted issues.

Who pays for that??. Its very rare that Microsoft sends out faulty patches and servicepacks.

If we see ourselves as betatesters then we shouldnt be paying a normal fee/price for the product.

Sébastien Riccio Replied

11/14/2024 at 1:15 PM

Brian, that's exactly how we feel at the moment. Even more since the price raised and the many issues we had and still have.

Sébastien Riccio

System & Network Admin

https://swisscenter.com

Brian Bjerring-Jensen - VonBjerring GmbH Replied

11/15/2024 at 1:22 AM

I get that... its been 126 builds since we last had a stable production environment using MAPI/EAS/EWS.

And thats a lot of trial and error and a lot af agony amongst clients and vendors using smartermail.

J

J. LaDow Replied

11/15/2024 at 5:26 AM

It's the exact reason why we did not renew our "Maintenance Agreement" -- The bugs already cost us multiple customers - and continuing to pay for "enterprise" labelled software that is not enterprise grade when continually released with bugs was and still is not cost effective for us.

MailEnable survivor / convert --

Jade B Replied

11/15/2024 at 5:51 AM

@J. LaDow - I share your sentiment regarding not wanting to renew maintenance and support and the only reason we have renewed ours over the years is incase there is a vulnerability and we need to patch our mail servers.

J

Jay Dubb Replied

11/16/2024 at 5:50 AM

This tends to bolster what many of us have been calling for, for a long time. Two tracks. One is a Stable track that focuses on bug fixes and perfecting the product, while NOT continually adding in new features. The other is a new-features-fast track, that prioritizes adding new features quickly-- a production track, but with somewhat of a "beta" feel where bugs are to be expected, for those brave enough or with a tolerant enough customer base, to risk bugs in return for getting the newest features the fastest.

If you run SM primarily for your own company's benefit... or if you throw in "free email" to a hosting package... the new-features track is probably for you.

For those of us whose business model is hosting Enterprise-level customers, we would much prefer STABLE, bug-free, predictable, safe, in return for not being on the bleeding edge. When a new bug is introduced, especially when it involves "malformed" or "sync" or other things primarily Outlook users are going to be impacted by, our customers DO notice and DO complain loudly... because Big Corporate lives and dies on Outlook and all of its features. WAY too many times, we've had to tap dance and throw ourselves under the bus, to keep a large customer (fed up from Outlook sync failures, etc) from moving to Exchange 365, because other executives in their orbit of friends and peers say that's the place to be.

We've been continuous Smartermail customers since version 3.x in 2006. Experience was superb. It wasn't until 2021 when we had a surge of demand for MAPI that we went that route, and to be honest, it's been a bumpy ride at times. We still love the product, but desperately wish for a "stable" track option with slower feature releases and a higher focus on quality-related updates.

R

Rudolf Replied

11/17/2024 at 1:00 AM

We already lost some customers to MS365. Every new version that i install i wait for phone calls from customers next day. There are always some bugs and i am thinking for switching to another software. Last week i renewed Maintenance for an additional year - there was a price increase of 43,6% from last year renewal for the same functionality. So we will look the new year and then we will decide switching to another software.

We are always running latest versions and hope that there will be less bugs in every new version.

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