My users have revolted
Question asked by Karl Jones - July 4, 2017 at 9:06 AM
Answered
I have now been officially asked to return all users to Outlook. The new interface, lack of responsiveness and refresh when scrolling through emails and the inability to review attachments prior to sending was just too much for too long.
I know you will be continuing to work on this new interface and API but in the end i updated too soon.... this product is still in beta as obvious faults and bugs are being reported en-masse.
I'm uncertain to be able to get the users off outlook.... maybe i should update them all to Outlook 2016 but i know that will really piss them off..!!!!

36 Replies

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Damir Matešić Replied
Outlook works fantastic (client and WEB). But Outlook cost some money?
Ok if you have Exchange mail server i don't understand why you will need Smartermail?
The true is that this new version of SM is still a big beta playground. This public release was not professional. To soon. To many open bugs and they are not solving issues. I have opened some bug reports 2 months ago and they are still open. Also, when the official beta was ongoing I did report same bugs but they then closed this beta thread and all diapered :)
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Karl Jones Replied
Just to be clear.... i built the server 2012 and installed SM 14 originally and never purchased exchange. I tried from the beginning to get everyone on SM but many management would/could not change due to the problems with SM.
We were told that 100's of thousands of users were now using SM16 after the beta had gone public for a short time and that it was considered stable, that is the only reason i changed.... i have found by experience that this was not true.
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Damir Matešić Replied
I buy a licence of SmarterMail for one year and when it will expire i doubt i will continue to use this solution. To much money for something not working.
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Damir Matešić Replied
No replies here.
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Assin Ontivi Replied
Quoted without further comment:
 
>>The new interface, lack of responsiveness and refresh when scrolling through emails and the inability to review attachments prior to sending was just too much for too long.
I know you will be continuing to work on this new interface and API but in the end i updated too soon.... this product is still in beta as obvious faults and bugs are being reported en-masse.<<
 
>>We were told that 100's of thousands of users were now using SM16 after the beta had gone public for a short time and that it was considered stable, that is the only reason i changed.... i have found by experience that this was not true.<<
 
>> I buy a licence of SmarterMail for one year and when it will expire i doubt i will continue to use this solution. To much money for something not working.<<
 
3
Paul Blank Replied
It is truly disheartening to read of all the bugs and issues with V16, which, judging from the many accounts seen on this forum, was released way too soon.
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Paul Blank Replied
If you're on V16, you'll probably be lots happier with V15, which is still being patched and supported (I hope for a long time at this point).
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Damir Matešić Replied
Stay on that. I think there is no easy downgrade of the product. I am revolted because nobody of the smartertools team are not responding for the mess they made with the new version.
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Ronald Raley Replied
Karl, so return to Outlook Exchange if that is what your customer really wants.

But in a short time, you will return to this forum and most likely see that all (or most) of the issues you are mentioning have been corrected.

I, personally, would encourage them to continue using SmarterMail.
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Ronald Raley Replied
We are running SmarterMail 16 with 350 domains and 9,000 users. Upgraded about a month ago. A couple of issues here and there, but otherwise all is running well. Your experiences may differ.
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Karl Jones Replied
I think you misread my post Ronald. I don't have exchange. I am running smartermail but my users can't or won't use the webmail interface and want to use Outlook, although it is and will be in IMAP mode.
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Karl Jones Replied
They are fixing things Damir but my point was that is was "released" and established as "stable" far too soon in my opinion.
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Karl Jones Replied
If you have 9000 users, i cannot believe that few of them are calling for support on many of the bugs that i found just by trying to use the web interface, including the crashes when trying to create and view reports...
I want SM to improve rapidly but if i had to make a comment or two it would be that they didn't have a running dummy version for people to login to and test and review the layout etc. They said it was out of beta when it clearly wasn't and said that hundred of thousands of users were running the new version and it was considered stable when obvious bugs could be spotted within minutes of trying to use it.
Other reported ones i also found so no need to duplicate.
Lastly and importantly a webmail interface should be fast, the way it appeared with SM 15 and it still isn't....
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Paul Blank Replied
One thing I can think of in their defense is that there is a user-limited free version (15 and 16 are available, I believe), that should be tested thoroughly if one is thinking about full deployment.
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Paul Blank Replied
I would, frankly, like to hear from others who have had the same degree of success as Ronald, above, with V16.
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Damir Matešić Replied
I tottaly agree with you.
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Damir Matešić Replied
Yes, how is possible that 9000 users on 350 domains didn't see one single BUG that same users like me found in about 15 minutes in the WEB interface. Maybe they are all using some Outlook like IMAP SW.
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Ronald Raley Replied
Each domain is a volunteer fire department. More accurately, I will say that they usually create user accounts for ALL of their members. Some of the firefighters use SmarterMail religiously. Others just forward all mail to a personal account.

1,000 active users and 8,000 inactive users is probably more accurate. I don't mean to mislead anyone.
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Ronald Raley Replied
@Damir We did, in fact, find some bugs. We reported them and most are fixed now.
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viv burrows Replied
No real issues with SM16 60 Domains, very happy. No reported speed issues
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Paul Blank Replied
Really good to hear from the "other side," so to speak. Most of what you see on this forum are complaints.
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Derek Curtis Replied
Employee Post Marked As Answer
With each version that is released, SmarterMail 16.x gets better, just as SmarterMail itself has since it was initially released. There is always some confusion and panic and "revolt" when things change. We've experienced this every time we've changed the interface or added or modified a feature. However, each change is built upon and improved, and the initial confusion eventually subsides.
 
As for using an external client, that's certainly an option. Outlook, Thunderbird, Apple Mail, eM Client all work well with SmarterMail over IMAP, EWS, or even using a webDAV protocol. We recently worked with the guys at CalDAV Synchronizer to get a fix put in place that greatly improves their product, and now it works as well, if not better, than our Add to Oulook plug-in. 
 
The .1 version that will be released this week brings even more improvements as well as the return of some features present in previous versions. A few examples: the ability to move the preview pane (or remove it completely); the ability to select contact lists, categories and contacts from the new message window; the ability to load or block images in the webmail client and create exceptions for allowing remote content by user/domain/URL, and more. That's on top of resolutions to many of the issues brought up in this Community as well as in tickets we've received.
 
There's no doubt that SmarterMail 16.x is a huge change...and it could be argued it's the biggest change we've made in the last 15 years. However, we're committed to it and committed to continually improving it. Obviously the larger issues are handled first, then we'll work our way down our list as quickly and as efficiently as we can, updating Community threads along the way. 
Derek Curtis
COO
SmarterTools Inc.
(877) 357-6278
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Karl Jones Replied
Thank you Derek. As i mentioned i have no doubt that SM16 will be improved and fixed. My issue was that i was trying to make some old souls move away from Outlook and recommend using SM Webmail. SM 15 had some limitations for my users and i posted and requested those features back then.

Upgrading from SM 15 was just too much for my users so now i have a battle to once more move from Outlook back to SM. If it had not been released too early and told it was stable (my considered opinion!) i would not be having the fight i am now and as Outlook 2007/2010 has some quirks when working with SM i am having to placate SM users who can't do certain things, and bugs stop them from doing cerrain things and Outlook users who come up against some of the limitations of Outlook and SM (like appointments showing in wrong calendar if opened in outlook!)
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John Marx Replied
I will concur that SmarterMail 16 works better with Outlook. My users have confirmed. They hate the web interface. I have our longest standing customers ready to leave us because of this change (happened over the weekend). The key problems and we've tested this is:
 
  • Speed - I know you've heard this but here's some tests
    • Client - old desktop (4Gig, Windows 7, dual core), good internet - IE, Chrome, Firefox, etc. ALL SLOW
    • Surface Pro 4 - same location - my box - it's quick i7, 16Gig, Windows 10, etc. - Fast
The tests were done at the exact same time. Client has only 1gig of email and maybe a dozen folders. Mine is a 10gig email and a over 50 folders. New technology is manageable. Don't like the hour glass (3-5 seconds per folder) but I can live with it. The client on a 10k email, clicks REPLY, and 117 seconds (average) the reply box comes up. That is too slow even for a 2400bps modem from the 1980's.
 
Based on this I know it's not the server, the servers connection, the clients connection but our clients older technology (6 years old). Yes it's old but we cannot force someone to buy new hardware.
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Paul Blank Replied
It appears that the folks most satisfied with V16 are using Outlook or other email clients, and are not using SM webmail. This implies that the underlying email engine is pretty solid, which is a positive thing.
 
However, I will not yet upgrade to V16 with most users on webmail. The webmail performance, and reported interface issues, would need to get lots better in order for my clients to do that.
 
(I've edited this reply. The previous text was quite unclear as to my intentions in posting it!)
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Joshua Koehler Replied
Hey Derek, I noticed you didn't mention search. Did the searching all folders when you don't know what folder your e-mail is in not make the cut for 16.1?
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Derek Curtis Replied
Employee Post
Joshua, search is something that is being addressed, but it's a rather large undertaking.
Derek Curtis
COO
SmarterTools Inc.
(877) 357-6278
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Joshua Koehler Replied
Gottcha; Thanks for the update.
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Paul Blank Replied
And it does not appear that the feature for searching all of a user's email, that works in versions prior to V16, is implemented yet.
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Noreen Braman Replied
We just got a refund for 16PRo and went back to the Free version, because the free version offers everything that Enterprise offers. We are a less than 10 person office, so the email restriction isn't a problem. All we wanted was shared calendars and group chat. Which isn't on PRO. I think that is a mistake, as that is a basic needed function and small offices shouldn't have to go to Enterprise just to do that. And right now, I can't even get the calendar to work for my own personal calendar, never mind trying to set up shared calendars. We had version 9 for forever, and only upgraded and bought a license because we were under the impression we could share calendars
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Paul Blank Replied
Did you "revert" to V15 or V16?
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Noreen Braman Replied
V16. Since we no longer have version upgrade protection with the free version I wanted to go with the most recent. Just figured out how to import my Google calendar so that that worked. Setting appointments works. Just can change the name of my calendar or the color, which will be a problem when we start sharing calendars. Going to try and set up a domain calendar now, and see if I can map to it.
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Paul Blank Replied
Thanks. ST are continuing to support V15, apparently for some time, as there are still many V16 issues to be addressed, especially with the Web interface, and things such as global search, missing from V16 as well.
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Noreen Braman Replied
Well apparently, with the free version, I can't get any support or upgrades for bug fixes, etc. So maybe we better go back to 15. SM has really put us between a rock and a hard place here. does 15 have the sharing calendars function? well, looks like you can't "downgrade" to 15 from 16 and can't restore older versions. Nice.
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Matt Petty Replied
Employee Post
You are able to downgrade, uninstall 16 then install 15. SmarterMail 15 also has shared calendars but they are under the same licensing restrictions.
Matt Petty
Software Developer
SmarterTools Inc.
(877) 357-6278
www.smartertools.com
0
Paul Blank Replied
I think you'll be pretty happy with 15.

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