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Yahoo blocking emails 553 5.7.2 [TSS09]
Question asked by ActorMike - 10/24/2023 at 7:33 AM
Answered
I just migrated SM to a new server that has new IP addresses. Yahoo is blocking our emails. Is this a setting I overlooked? All the others seem fine.

Remote Server returned: '553 5.7.2 [TSS09] All messages from xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx will be permanently deferred; Retrying will NOT succeed. See https://postmaster.yahooinc.com/error-codes'

Also, I read somewhere that Yahoo uses Spamhaus, we are not listed on Spamhaus.

I pass on the tests on MXToolBox
What about SPF and DKIM in your DNS settings?
Zach Sylvester Replied
10/24/2023 at 7:59 AM
Employee Post
Hello, 

In addition to checking your SPF, DKIM, and DMARC records I also suggest that you sign up for this. 
Yahoo's Complaint Feedback Loop (CFL) aids email senders in managing spam complaints to improve their sending reputation. When a user marks an email as spam, it's recorded and could affect the sender's reputation. By joining the CFL program, senders receive forwarded complaints from Yahoo about perceived spam emails from their domain. This program only supports DomainKeys Identified Mail (DKIM)-signed emails. 

Let me know if this helps. 

Thanks, 

Zach Sylvester

Software Developer
SmarterTools Inc.
ActorMike Replied
10/24/2023 at 9:10 AM
Yeah, I've been doing all that stuff for years. Since we migrated, all the settings were copied from the old server and the IP addresses were changed.

Sent email to @gmail.com he headers indicate:

Authentication-Results: mx.google.com;
       dkim=pass
    DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256;
       spf=pass

have RDNS setup aka pointer

I've been setup for the complaint feedback loop on Yahoo and Microsoft for years, once a week we get a false spam complaint from our Xenforo Forums and I ban those users.
J
J. LaDow Replied
10/24/2023 at 10:24 AM
When we migrated from MailEnable to SM, we had to re-fight AT&T/Yahoo as well as Microsoft (even though we are in both feedback loops) because our IP address changed and those providers basically auto-block any new IPs or IPs that come from certain real estate like AWS.

It took two weeks of back and forth before our new IP was cleared and able to send inbound. Every time we have an IP change, this happens. This is even with SPF, DKIM, and DMARC properly configured.

Many hosts arbitrarily block new IPs and make you fight to get them unblocked.

Years ago we had to threaten Microsoft with legal action before we got unblocked - even though our IPs have NEVER been on a list except for one incident almost 20 years ago (before the DNSBLs were really even a thing)...
MailEnable survivor / convert --
ActorMike Replied
10/24/2023 at 11:15 AM
J. LaDown- AT&T fixed it within hours, haven't heard a peep back from Yahoo using this support form- Here is where I submitted last week-  https://senders.yahooinc.com/contact/

Looks like they are the only problem. I hated to move servers but ours was 5 years old and we were paying 300 per month and now paying 64.00 month for a MUCH FASTER server! 2x Intel Octo-Core E5-2680v2 - 96GB - 240GB SSD + 1TB HDD
kevind Replied
10/24/2023 at 12:36 PM
Wow, that's a nice server for $64.  Can I ask where?
TIA,
Kevin
ActorMike Replied
10/24/2023 at 1:13 PM
Ron- It's a small business called DediOutlet. Use my affiliate link to sign up to save $$$ https://bit.ly/DediOutlet

The control panel for the server is amazing. Can install pretty much any O/S, reinstall an O/S power on/off the server, reboot it etc. Could not do any of that at Aptum and waited almost an hour for them to power back on a server I inadvertently shut down!

I used Serverbeach, that was bought by Peer1, that was bought by Aptum. They are the big dogs. They keep raising the prices all the time after covid, even on old servers. Also, they charge you monthly for Windows and at this place, they activate a 6 month trial. You can either re-trigger the 6 months on that 5 times, or I bought an activation key online for 30 bucks!

I was paying 300 bucks a month for an old server Windows 2016 Standard Server Intel Xeon E5-2620 v3 @2.4 GHZ with only 32GB ram!
J
J. LaDow Replied
10/24/2023 at 10:36 PM
@ActorMike -- If memory serves me correctly, AT&T and Yahoo share some infrastructure -- in the past, resolution with AT&T has provided some relief with Yahoo services.  This may be different now after changes and sales/mergers.

I fought Yahoo once and eventually through email managed to get things resolved.

@Web Team -- I know about the warm-up periods - but to be honest, with an established company, those should not be a requirement.  That was our argument when fighting Microsoft and AT&T - we had to bring up the fact that we already had established mail service with a clean reputation and their preemptive blocking of IPs without even consulting their own systems where we can identify the IPs we send from.  Our main point was why do you have forms we can fill out if you fail to reference those forms when we start communications with those IPs in question.

I get the real-world scenario - but it's flawed - and the actions by the big providers (who are a major source of spam themselves - especially Google) with unilateral preemptive blocking does nothing but line the pockets of services like SMTP2GO because many providers can't wait weeks to warm up an IP just because of a unilateral block without reason.  Additionally, why should we be forced to outsource our mail delivery just because they can't create a proper system for established providers (especially ones already registered in their networks) to immediately unblock IPs and enable communications...
MailEnable survivor / convert --
ActorMike Replied
10/25/2023 at 7:08 AM
AT&T may share the same infrastructure with Yahoo, but I contacted AT&T at abuse_rbl@abuse-att.net 
they responded and now emails go through to ATT and Prodigy.

Our only problem now is @Yahoo.com

I will keep bugging them and eventually get off the blacklist I hope!
Sabatino Replied
10/25/2023 at 11:17 PM
This is one of the reasons why it would be useful to have SMTP routing rules

I keep suggesting it but I get totally ignored. Not even an explanation as to why SM doesn't consider it something to develop.

Imagine being able to set this rule

If the recipient is @yahoo.com use the following outbound gateway.

You could use smtp2go only for yahoo.com while the new IP gains reputation. With the same logic, other blocks or other specific situations could be resolved.
Sabatino Traini
      Chief Information Officer
Genial s.r.l. 
Martinsicuro - Italy
I agree with Sabatino! That could be a great function to add to add to SmarterMail!
Gabriele Maoret - Head of SysAdmins and CISO at SERSIS
Currently manages 6 SmarterMail installations (1 in the cloud for SERSIS which provides services to a few hundred third-party email domains + 5 on-premise for customers who prefer to have their mail server in-house)
Sabatino Replied
10/26/2023 at 7:25 AM
Gabriel.
I have proposed this functionality many times. But SM has never said anything about it. The community didn't react much either.
I believe that those who have larger servers use an ouboung gateway and then make any routing rules from there.

On some domains I also do this even if in my case it's just a crazy trick.
Imagine that to use the routing rules, some rules on smtp outbound (content filter doesn't work on outbound in sm.. this is also crazy) I use one of my Icewarp servers as a gateway and then from there I make routing rules and outgoing filters.


I really don't understand why SM lacks these features.
Maybe SM has an explanation, but he never gave it to me
Sabatino Traini
      Chief Information Officer
Genial s.r.l. 
Martinsicuro - Italy
ActorMike Replied
10/26/2023 at 11:11 AM
I'm desperate now so I just started emailing executives at Yahoo, sending them tweets and Linkedin messages. LOL 

Regarding feature suggestions, my experience has been that software vendors do what they want. On our Forum software, they have people vote for features on their forums, but who's got time to read that all the time and vote? LOL

This support page is a farse- https://senders.yahooinc.com/contact/

AT&T resolved right away though!
ActorMike Replied
10/26/2023 at 4:48 PM
@Ron the Yahoo feedback loop does not work by IP address, it works by domain- https://senders.yahooinc.com/complaint-feedback-loop/

I tried to update it though a couple of days ago, it did not help. I will try to use the "add" option and see if that works.
J
J. LaDow Replied
10/26/2023 at 7:41 PM
I posted earlier an error regarding AT&T and Yahoo affiliation - but it's actually AOL that's affiliated - the AT&T/Yahoo was long ago.

Maybe blowing up AOL's postmaster loop will clear up Yahoo. Granted, Yahoo runs the infrastructure, but just maybe a needle in the haystack getting you unblocked.
MailEnable survivor / convert --
ActorMike Replied
10/27/2023 at 5:24 AM
AOL/Verizon Postmaster both lead to the Yahoo page. Yahoo totally controls it- https://help.aol.com/articles/aol-bulk-email-exception-list-allow-list
ActorMike Replied
10/27/2023 at 11:47 AM
Yahoo was early, but lacked leadership a cautionary tale for investors on A.I. Anyone remember the 199.00 express fee to get reviewed quickly for inclusion in the Yahoo directory?  They could reject your application with no refunds and did this several times to customers I designed websites for so you would have to appeal it.

Then they decided to charge 299 per year instead of 199 lifetime.

Customer service was lame.

Then came Google!
ActorMike Replied
10/29/2023 at 6:43 PM
Marked As Answer
Finally got an email from postmastersupport@cc.yahoo.com asking for the same information I submitted on the website above. LOL

Either they were blocking me, or they were getting blocked because I ended up sending a message to them from my @gmail.com account and get a reply back same day! Definitely takes effort!

Whitelist postmastersupport@cc.yahoo.com if you ever have a problem getting messages from them or send via Gmail.com

Our Engineers have requested some additional information in order to investigate this issue for you. Please reply with answers to the following questions: 
 
If sending email failed, what exact message did you get and when (date + time)?
Are you an ESP or a hosting provider?
How many email recipients do you send to?
How many emails do you send per IP (or in total)?
Which IPs/IP range do you send through?
Is this IP/range new to your company?
ActorMike Replied
10/30/2023 at 2:59 PM
Update they unblocked us about 3 hours later! YEAH!
ActorMike Replied
2/12/2024 at 7:16 PM
I've had two people email me this week about this topic saying that are blocked at Yahoo. I got an email from AWS a few weeks ago stating that in FEB 2024, Yahoo was going to start cracking down on bounces and spam complaints.

Make sure you are in the feedback complaint loop! We have clowns on our Ford Thunderbird Forum that will report valid forum messages as spam, so I started banning them last year. Glad I weeded them out.
J
JOHN MICHEAL Replied
2/13/2024 at 10:59 PM
How You weeded them out from Your database.. Now You have any block issue...
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